Wednesday, May 21, 2008
Is Jack a coward?
In today's discussion, it was brought up that Jack is going to need to "man up" if they are going to survive. That he needs to stop being a coward and just kill the pig. He has a knife, but has been unable to use it. Do you think that Jack is truly a coward or do you think that he is just a 12 year old boy who is still operating under the "laws" and "rules" of a civilized society?
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14 comments:
ok well I definitely think that he's still operating under the "laws" and "rules" of a civilized society because it would be seen as morally wrong for a 12 year old to kill this innocent pig but he's definitely losing his civilized side pretty quickly and becoming somewhat savage like and he wants to gratify his immediate desires rather than to value the good of the group.
There is definitely a conflict between savagery and civilization in this chapter and its obvious it's going to continue in the book.
I somewhat agree with Paola. There is a definite connection between savagery and civilization. Nevertheless, to live in a society that these boys are living in, demands instinct-like behaviors, like an animal. To Jack, you have to act like an animal to kill an animal. However, Jack somewhat contradicts himself when he gets on all fours, like an animal, but then he acts like a coward and just throws the spear at the pig. You dont kill an animal like that. You have to attack it as if you are the predator and the pig is the prey. If Jack doesnt sac up and kill the pig, there is no way they are going to survive just on fruit. I also agree with Paola about Jack getting his instant gratification with killing the pig. Jack should stop his narrow-mindedness and consider the neccessities required for him and the boys to survive on this island.
Jack is not a coward. He is just a kid and he was afraid of killing the pig. I dont think he has killed before so that explains why he couldnt kill it. He also doesnt have the knowledge to do it. But im sure he'll get better by practicing.
Ok, Kyle....do you see a problem if all the boys start acting on "instinct-like behaviors"? I agree, to survive sometimes we must resort to behavior that we would not ordinarily practice, but what if all the boys act on instinct? Or should there be a specific time and place for that type of behavior? Before you answer, think about life in general...not just the society on the island. Is there a time when all people, men and women, must act on instinct alone?
i don't think that jack is necessarily a 'coward'. i think that he's just a 12 year old boy, who hasn't let go of civilization just yet. to kill an animal, one needs to get down at eye level with and kill it. to have all the pressure of having to kill the animal at such a young age is probably a difficult task. i think what's keeping jack from actually killing the creature is because he still has a bit of civilization in him. even though throughout the chapters, he seems to have shed it off, he still grew up learning what to do, and what not to do. because he's human, he probably still has a guilty conscience.
Jack is not so much operating off "laws" and "civilization" because there aren't any laws which say that people cannot kill pigs for food. In addition, killing an animal which you intend to eat is probably more civilized then buying processed meat products. I have the utmost confidence that later on in the book, Jack will finally hunt the pig and get the meat. As each day goes on he will probably have a desire which grows and grows. In the end this desire will over come the little boys fear of killing his own food.
In our society, we are not taught how to survive in the wild. Instead we are taught to read and write and do math. And when you're still only 12 years old, you don't really have enough mind to question this. Jack is simply behaving in a manner that he has believed his whole life to be acceptable and presentable. Killing an animal is something that is rarely even witnessed by civilized, modernized human beings, let alone taught. Jack is behaving how he believes humans should behave because he has grown up believing one thing because he is privileged enough to live in a world where most if not all of the harsh and ugly realities of life, including the somewhat grotesqueness of the natural food chain, is hidden from plain sight. We as human beings have evolved from animal-killing, barbarians to what we are today. And today, is it rare to see a human being hunting and eating his own food.
Jack is operating under the "laws" and "rules" of society. He is only twelve and was raised under that system. I think it would have to take a long time and/or a lot of experiences to break Jack from that rutine thinking. As of now, Jack is still thinking under a civilized maner, it is the only way he knows to think and for someone so young I think it would be frightening to think in any other way. It is the unknown that is scary and the fact that Jack would have to change into something or someone that is "unknown" to all of the boys would be scary and would only be caused by a lot of drive and force. Because Jack is still young, though young enough to have some understanding, he is not being "cowardly". He does not know and does not have enough experiences in his life to be categorized as cowardly. To kill is something that is feared by people that are 12 years old its not something that, if necessary, would be the way to go about something. Jack does need to kill the pig not only for himself but for all of the boys on the island. If Jack does decide to kill he will go through a lot of maturing a short period of time and it will cause drasttic effects on him mentally, physically, and the way he presents himself. But as of now Jack is still controlled and fixed under civilized society.
Jack had a mental block against killing the pig because he felt badly for it. He was not afraid of killing it. I don't think it had anything to do with cowardice, or even the impact that society had on him back home, thats not what anyone would have been thinking about, he was thinking about the reality of killing the pig. It is his own human instinct that induces his hesitance, and has nothing to do with fear nor society.
I can understand why it would be mentally difficult to kill a pig at age twleve. Jack is familiar with the rules and laws of society because he was raised with them. Saying that, Jack still needs to "man-up" if he want to live.
In Chapter 4 the boys begin to paint their faces which in turn gives them added freedom to behave in ways they would not do at home. Do you believe the same phenomenon is true for our society? What are some masks people hide behind????
he is still too young to kill living things. Often times, young children are much more humane than adults and have a hard time harming animals. It is not uncommon to see a child upset because they witnessed the death of an animal.
i think that people do still hide behind masks. probably every single person hides behind a mask in some way -- like sports. for some sports, like football, people wear helmets and uniforms. behind these uniforms could be the nicest people, but when in dress, they can be the most aggressive, scary people on the field.
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